Chimp & See Talk

Chimp (Geographic) Variations

  • zoogirl1 by zoogirl1

    It has recently come to my attention that there are actually 4 distinct variations of chimps based on location (West African, Eastern, Central) and Bonobo (only in Congo).

    Very different facial characterisitcs - complexion color, fur, balding patterns. I attributed these to usual variations in population. Guess not.

    Any use?

    Posted

  • MimiA by MimiA scientist, moderator

    Hi @zoogirl1

    It would be great if you could cite where you got that information from because although people with a lot of experience can sometimes tell the subspecies apart, it isn't really cut and dry. You can see for yourself that it is very challenging for example in the videos from Restless Star (Eastern chimps) and Aged Violet (Western chimps). Also, in zoos and sanctuaries the chimps are usually of unkown origin/subspecies unless there are very clear records of where they (or their fore-bearers) were wild caught or if genetic tests were done.

    Thanks for sharing!

    Posted

  • zoogirl1 by zoogirl1

    I have a book - The Kingdon Field Guide to African Mammals by Jonathan Kingdon 2nd edition

    The primate section - page 96 in particular - has the four different faces. Previous page has the description for the differences.

    I have found it useful for the duikers also. if you can't get the source for some reason, I could try to take a pic or somehow get the info here.

    Posted

  • zoogirl1 by zoogirl1

    This is the image for the face variations. Source cited above:

    https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B30S34nQ6uFSejhHalM2bmo3SXc

    Posted

  • MimiA by MimiA scientist, moderator

    It is certainly interesting but as far as I know there is a lot of overlap between the morphological variation seen across subspecies:

    for example

    east african chimps: https://www.facebook.com/pg/NgogoChimps/photos/?ref=page_internal

    central chimps: http://www.congo-apes.org/the-apes/

    thanks for sharing though!

    Posted

  • AnLand by AnLand moderator

    Just because I stumbled about another illustration of chimp subspecies variation and it's kind of different from @zoogirl1's earlier posting. In my opinion the big ears and form of brows (in the P. t. verus species) are in good agreement with our Western African sites. For me these differences mainly mean that at a certain site, some phenotypic traits might be spread wider and are maybe not enough to distinguish between the individuals as several might be that bald or have exceptionally big ears, independent from whether this is a subspecies, or just "family" thing. But I wanted to post it ...

    enter image description here

    The illustration by Stephen D. Nash is from https://portals.iucn.org/library/sites/library/files/documents/2003-126.pdf

    Posted

  • ksigler by ksigler moderator

    I agree with @MimiA that this is interesting, but must be taken with a grain of salt. There will be significant variations within the variations that can't be captured in a single illustration. Still super fascinating, though! (I try to play the, "where are they from" game with people's facial structures, as well, but it's even more convoluted.)

    Posted

  • AnLand by AnLand moderator

    Even if not discussing anything here anymore. Here finally the picture from @zoogirl1 - it's just nice.

    Source: Jonathan Kingdon: The Kingdon Field Guide to African Mammals, Second Edition, London 2015 (Bloomsbury), p. 96

    enter image description here

    For linking pictures, you need to provide not only a web link, but a direct picture link. Something like: "http://xxyyxxyy.jpg".

    Posted

  • AnLand by AnLand moderator

    We can use this thread – without reference to subspecies differences that might be more genetically and geographically motivated than phenotypically – to raise a bit more awareness to the general differences in the appearance between individual chimps apart from cuts, scars, and missing limbs that are rather "personal". We could look at different baldness patterns, brow forms, grayness on the back/legs, beards etc. and make some good visual comparisons for other volunteers. There seems to be some interest in this and it might help for the general matching process.

    I start with an example for balding patterns. (Collages like this can be made with Be funky if anyone is interested.)

    enter image description here

    Posted

  • AnLand by AnLand moderator

    Another facial feature that we are discussing during chimp matching are the brow forms. They can be straight, rounded, anything in between and may feature some damage as well. As in humans, chimp brows are to a certain extent mobile, e.g., can be raised. Different camera angles and distances can alter the appearance of the brows as well. You may find this work sheet interesting (thanks @NuriaM for the link).

    And here some visuals:

    enter image description here

    Posted