Chimp & See Talk

2. ACP00021n9 and CSJuv09 ?

  • NuriaM by NuriaM scientist, moderator

    What do you think, could this male juvenile in ACP00021n9 be #CSJuv09 (male too)?

    ACP00021n9, 4/25/2013enter image description here

    #CSJuv09 ( ACP00021m5 ) , 4/26/2013enter image description here

    enter image description here

    Same place, one day apart. Only rears, but body build and anal area shape and coloration might fit 😕

    Not completely sure, but I think the videos are worth watching.

    Posted

  • ksigler by ksigler moderator

    Whew, @NuriaM, what are you doing to us? 😃 This is a tough call. To me, the legs of Juv09 look thinner, and the belly less round (this part being variable, I know). Still looking through the other juveniles for an alternate option, but I personally can't see enough evidence on this match yet to say, "without a doubt."

    Posted

  • AnLand by AnLand moderator

    I am also not sure whether we see enough. The circumstances speak for this match as in both instances the same female is around: #CSFemale08c ( ACP00021mx ), #CSFemale09 ( ACP00021n1 ), and #CSFemale09b ( ACP00021lt ) and a small juvenile that still is named Eddy for all instances (but that might be a leftover from the earlier match).

    I am pretty sure that the female is the same (body build, dark back, swelling - just a day apart, bald head) and that we see enough traits to exclude all other known females based on different body build, back coloration, the damaged ear, or the size of the small juvenile (supposedly her big infant Eddy).

    Though, there is no visible direct interaction between any of the chimps. Body size of the male juvenile fit, back view as well. I would go for it, but there is not much proof.

    Posted

  • NuriaM by NuriaM scientist, moderator in response to ksigler's comment.

    thanks @ksigler, I know, and I´m so sorry...I tend to be very positive on Fridays 😄

    I think the legs of ACP00021n9 look thicker because he´s closer to the camera. But you are right, this is a very tough one!

    Posted

  • NuriaM by NuriaM scientist, moderator in response to AnLand's comment.

    Thank you @AnLand!

    we could wait for some more opinions, but today I´m not feeling very positive about it (Monday 😄 )

    Posted

  • Boleyn by Boleyn moderator

    I'm so sorry @NuriaM but I must take the risk of being the killjoy here: although it is possible, that this is the same juvenile, what have we gained with that? We still have no clue how he looks or if it is an already known juvenile. So far my understanding of matching was that we can only definitively match chimps when there are enough visible traits - even if the circumstances speak for a match like @AnLand explained above?

    Posted

  • NuriaM by NuriaM scientist, moderator in response to Boleyn's comment.

    welcome back @Boleyn!!

    We should focus on individuals showing clear traits in order to try to match them. This was the very first idea, but we have gained experience and now we are even able to match rears...as long as there are distinctive traits like bald patches or scars. But in the juveniles case, matching rears gets very tricky, so yes, let´s reject this tough one. He will be given a demID at the end 😃

    thanks!!

    Posted

  • Boleyn by Boleyn moderator

    😄

    Posted