Chimp & See Talk

Group of chimps feeding, one female with face view - Tamara

  • AnLand by AnLand moderator

    A group of chimps is feeding. I think, mainly female. In the back might be an older juvenile. Good face shot from one female: very round eye brows, ears stick out, thinner hair on forehead and bald spot above right brow. Round face, big nostrils, beard. Mouth looks big, but she is feeding and might have food in her mouth. ACP0005sna (for completeness: ACP0005snb, ACP0005snc, ACP0005snd)

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    Posted

  • Boleyn by Boleyn moderator

    The series actually starts at ACP0005sn4 (not much to see in 4 - 7)
    ACP0005sn8 and ACP0005sn9 is a bit better, mainly due to a juvenile. But probably not close enough for an ID:

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    It continues up to ACP0005snj but none of them has a better view of any of the chimps. The last series takes place in the evening starting with ACP0005sng

    Posted

  • PauDG by PauDG scientist, moderator

    Hi all!
    @Boleyn, is true that probably with this videos we won't ID, they are far and behind branches. The best seeing is the juvenile, but still far... but, we never know. Thanks for put the videos here anyway.

    @AnLand, the female from ACP0005sna, will be LSFem05. Very good description!

    Posted

  • AnLand by AnLand moderator

    Ok, this is only guess work and probably not solvable in this early stage of the site. But: female, younger adult with round brows, balder forehead and ears that stick out. (from two different cameras (how fancy is this!): ACP0005tvl and ACP0005tvm as well as ACP0005u0c). I know, too far away. But I would like to note it here.

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    Posted

  • jwidness by jwidness moderator

    So the video IDs aren't actually in chronological order. I looked through the spreadsheet and figured out how the full sequence goes for the morning of 10/3/2013. No videos are missing from the middle of the sequence, and I'm pretty sure we also have the first and last ones too.

    First, at 5:57 we have ACP0005sn0, ACP0005sn1, ACP0005sn2, ACP0005sn3. It's still very dark and a big male is feeding in the back. A juvenile walks through as well.

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    Then at 6:16, ACP0005smw, ACP0005smx, ACP0005smy, ACP0005smz. There are now around 7 chimps, including a big male and a juvenile, but they are all far and not even worth posting previews.

    Next, at 6:22, ACP0005sn8, ACP0005sn9, ACP0005sna, ACP0005snb. At least 5 chimps, but all probably too far to ID except for LSFem05, which AnLand posted above.

    At 6:24 we have ACP0005snc, ACP0005snd, ACP0005sne, ACP0005snf. At least 4 chimps, all far.

    Then at 6:25 ACP0005sn4, ACP0005sn5, ACP0005sn6, ACP0005sn7. At least 4, mostly nearly impossible to see.

    The evening sequence that starts with ACP0005sng is actually mangabeys, but I had to double check since they all kind of look like dark blobs eating. ; )

    So many videos here, it's too bad we really can't see much 😕

    Posted

  • jwidness by jwidness moderator in response to AnLand's comment.

    I agree the female in ACP0005tvl and ACP0005tvm looks like it could be LSFem05 and is something to keep in mind. I also saw a very swollen female in a video found by @Orohena -- ACP0005n3e

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    Between the food in her mouth, and the quality of the video, it's also mostly a guess at this point, but she looks like LSFem05 to me too. What do you think?

    Posted

  • PauDG by PauDG scientist, moderator

    Hi all!!

    They seem the same, look these two pictures. I can see the same face, and also the same hair patron in the left arm...

    one ACP0005sna

    one ACP0005n3e

    about the one in ACP0005tvl, is very blurred and I don't feel as sure as with the other. But we can put her as LSFem05a, as possible match with LSFem05.

    Posted

  • PauDG by PauDG scientist, moderator in response to jwidness's comment.

    Hi @jwidness
    about your post with all the videos, maybe we can move it to a new thread and leave this one to talk about LSFem05?
    Thanks!

    Posted

  • jwidness by jwidness moderator in response to PauDG's comment.

    We can certainly move it, but I don't think there are any individuals besides LSFem05 that can be ID'd, and I mostly wrote it as a response to Boleyn's comment, just to have the whole context of the scene. I think my preference would be to leave it for now, but start a new thread if we later decide that any other individuals can maybe be identified. Is that ok?

    Posted

  • AnLand by AnLand moderator in response to jwidness's comment.

    I am supporting @PauDG request. Maybe we can - in general - separate the threads in more ID-related ones and thematic ones, where not ID plays a role, but the feeding / traveling party as such (also for later "counting"), things like tool use etc. It also makes it easier for other participants to keep track of our discussions. And I think, it is in general no problem to discuss other things as ID here at the board, or? That's why I made this family trip thread despite nothing to ID at all. But it is interesting and only in the comments section nobody will find it again and can keep all related videos together.

    Posted

  • PauDG by PauDG scientist, moderator

    Hi all,
    yes, you can kept it, or move to a new one, even of we can not ID any chimp. We can also talk about other things but I think that is easier if we can keep separate the topics...as you prefer.
    Thanks!

    Posted

  • PauDG by PauDG scientist, moderator

    Hi all,

    we need a name to this match between

    LSFem09 ACP0005sna
    one

    And ACP0005n3e

    one

    I think that @jwidness proposed the match.

    Thanks!!

    Posted

  • AnLand by AnLand moderator

    I answer here this other post about the possible match of this new female ACP0005jwm and ACP0005jwn to LSFem05. I have a bit problems with the brows that I see a bit rounder and bulkier in LSFem05. Of course, the videos are all not the best and it is not only b/w mode, but also still quite dark. Slim body build and what looks like a smaller size would fit (better than the more stocky body of LSFem04, I agree.)

    But I can quite good see the match to the other female ( ACP0005tvl and ACP0005tvm as well as ACP0005u0c), I proposed as a match to her. Maybe because both sequences are daylight, colored videos.

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    Posted

  • jwidness by jwidness moderator in response to PauDG's comment.

    I think AnLand has a special interest in this lady, so I'll defer to her for a name 😃

    Posted

  • AnLand by AnLand moderator

    Yes, I do have a special interest and would like to name her Tamara. Thanks, @jwidness, I appreciate this!

    Posted

  • PauDG by PauDG scientist, moderator

    ok, so we agree that ACP0005jwm is LSFem05a (Tamara for now)

    But, what about LSFem05 and ACP0005n3e? Do you think that they are also Tamara? I will keep LSFem05 and ACP0005n3e separated from Tamara, but without a name, just in case we decide to do the match to don't loose one name.

    Thanks!

    Posted

  • AnLand by AnLand moderator

    Hi @PauDG, just to get this right before I argument furthermore. We agreed on the match for LSFem05a (now Tamara) with two scenes and also a - for now separate - match on LSFem05 (in some posts aka LSFem09) in two scenes, right? So, the question now is whether we match them all together? I am just a bit confused now, but this is the direction we want to go, I think.

    Posted

  • PauDG by PauDG scientist, moderator

    Exactly, that is.

    Now we have:

    So, we think that all are the same? Thanks!

    Posted

  • AnLand by AnLand moderator

    I totally agree that all both have the same body build. The movements are not comparable as LSFem05 is both times feeding and Tamara both times "observing". The ears stick out in all of them. The brows are not straight or round, but in between. I cannot say much more and I am not 100% sure, but also see nothing against the match.

    What puzzles me a bit is the swelling and timing (all 2013)

    September 4th ACP0005tvl, ACP0005tvm, and ACP0005u0c - might be some days after maximum swelling

    September 30th ACP0005jwm and ACP0005jwn - might be maximum swelling

    October 3rd ACP0005sn8 - might be some days after maximum swelling

    but September 15th ACP0005n3e - she also have a quite big swelling

    Until now, we've seen: big and really small swellings and clear stages in between. It does not seem to be the case here. I mean, she is quite young and might be recent immigrant. Maybe she has longer swellings, is better fed, I don't know. It is just different than as I thought it "should" be.

    Posted

  • PauDG by PauDG scientist, moderator

    Hi AnLand,

    here some information about this topic:

    "Females have a mean cycle length of about 36 days (Deschner et al., 2003; Wallis, 1982; Yerkes and Elder,1936) and an average duration of the maximum tumescence phase of the swelling of about 10 days (Deschner et al., 2003; Matsumoto-Oda and Oda, 1998; Tutin, 1979)"

    Female sexual swelling size, timing of ovulation, and male behavior in
    wild West African chimpanzees

    Posted