Bare spots on female

by AnLand moderator

@teemie found this video of a juvenile followed by a female. The female seems to have larger bare fur spots on the upper arm and torso on the left side, but also a bigger white spot on the right shoulder blad. The black-and-white footage might pronouced it a bit, but I think these are bigger bare spots (and more) than we have seen before anywhere. Are these wounds, scars, a disease or just a bad fur? What do you think?

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Posted April 15, 2016 7:14 PM

by hoothoot

Could be missing fur - either from a previous wound, over-grooming or a disease

Posted April 16, 2016 5:30 PM

by jwidness moderator

I think this is the same female, but I'm not sure the view is good enough to rule out known chimps. She's large, dark face with a good amount of balding on the forehead, and a big bald spot on the right shoulder. Pointed out in ACP000bhx3 by @Snorticus

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Posted June 15, 2016 6:55 PM

by luca-chimp

And here ACP000bqox she really looks not healthy …
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Posted June 15, 2016 7:03 PM

by maureenmccarthy scientist, moderator

I have added them as RSFem11 and RSJuv11 for now, then hopefully we can determine if they are among the known individuals or are new.

Posted June 19, 2016 2:16 PM

by maureenmccarthy scientist, moderator

For clarity I have split these and given a different prospective ID to the female in ACP000bhx3--she is now listed as RSFem11b. I am still not sure whether she/they are among the known chimps. Input welcome!

Posted September 11, 2016 4:55 PM

by AnLand moderator

Maybe - as we are discussing this now again - somebody could just briefly go into my question above? I know that this is pure speculation, but what could have caused this? Maybe you have some examples for comparison. Thanks!

Posted September 12, 2016 8:10 AM

by maureenmccarthy scientist, moderator

This is actually a great reason to work on the IDs. If we can ID her across the study period we can first determine whether the missing hair is a temporary condition for a brief period or more consistently present, which could help determine why she might have that appearance.

Posted September 13, 2016 4:59 PM

by AnLand moderator in response to maureenmccarthy's comment.

Yes, that's why I am asking. I see here from the very beginning Pegasi and Snoop. Everything fits (balding, face, body build ... and the juvenile). But we do have a video from them on March 17, 2013 ( ACP000cgmf ). This one here should be after March 12, 2013 - I cannot say how much later. In the earlier video, her fur looks normal. So, a skin/fur condition can rather not operate so fast, I guess. Only a fight could? But it does not look like some kind of wounds, or? We do not see the "bad side" well in the other video ... That's why I ask for an opinion. Sorry!

Posted September 13, 2016 5:11 PM

by AnLand moderator

I just had a brief look at the other match proposal here (RSFem11b in ACP000bhx3). There is also a juvenile present that looks like Snoop. There is another adult chimp in front (I guess a male) and Swing is in the group who doesn't have a kid (we think). So, it still might be the same family. This video ACP000bhx3 is from after March 22nd, 2013. So, if it is a short-time development at least this does not disagree.

Posted September 14, 2016 6:40 AM

by maureenmccarthy scientist, moderator

Yes, in context this seems pretty reasonable to me. Also, Pegasi has a very hunched posture and that is evident in these videos as well. Any other thoughts on this?

Posted October 4, 2016 9:43 AM

by jwidness moderator

I'd love to know the actual timestamps on these....

Posted October 4, 2016 3:59 PM

by AnLand moderator in response to jwidness's comment.

But can't you just look them up? I mean, you have access to the original data for making and sorting the chimp videos list, right? I would love to know the date as well. I'm quite convinced about whom I see here, but the time line is a bit fast. Maybe you can provide us with the time stamp here.

Posted October 4, 2016 4:12 PM

by jwidness moderator in response to AnLand's comment.

I don't have that information, sorry. The sort is based on the video number off of the camera (which you can see displayed in the spreadsheet). But the videos could be seconds apart or days apart, the order doesn't give any indication of the actual time passed.

Posted October 4, 2016 4:29 PM

by AnLand moderator in response to jwidness's comment.

Oh, I always thought that you can see this in more detail. I did know how the minute count is working, though.

Posted October 4, 2016 5:18 PM

by MimiA scientist, moderator

Hi all - Jane has been very patient with us and asking us about the timestamps for months (maybe even over a year now!) - we are very close to providing it to you guys soon!

Posted October 5, 2016 4:19 PM

by maureenmccarthy scientist, moderator

Any timestamp info that helps us here, @jwidness?

Posted November 8, 2016 9:52 AM

by jwidness moderator

Pegasi with no apparent hair loss: ACP000bijv 11-Mar-2013, ACP000cgmf 15-Mar-2013

female with bald spots: ACP000bqow 18-Mar-2013, ACP000bhx3 4-Apr-2013

It's possible that hair loss could show up between the 15th and the 18th, so I don't think we can rule out Pegasi based on the date.

Posted November 8, 2016 2:18 PM

by AnLand moderator

We have here an at least halfway agreement about RSFem11b as Pegasi (with Snoop in the same video clip already confirmed). I think, this match is more certain than RSFem11 and maybe we could do this one and leave 11 with the big bald spots out?

Posted January 19, 2019 4:03 PM

by Snorticus

ACP000bqow - Looks like Pegasi to me, cone-triangular shaped centered bald spot, prominent light brow wraps around side of her eyes, hunched posture, small black closely-set nostrils.

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