Chimp & See Talk

Caruso--AVmale05b?

  • puddock by puddock

    AVmale05b Wondering if this could be AVmale05b?

    Posted

  • Snorticus by Snorticus in response to puddock's comment.

    Hi puddock, We need a link to the URL of the clip so we can look at him in action ACP000_ _ _ _

    Thanks 😃

    Posted

  • puddock by puddock

    Thanks Snorticus - he's in a few sequential videos - here's one Image ACP000fwfy

    Posted

  • PauDG by PauDG scientist, moderator

    Hi all

    well seen @puddock !

    Actually this video is part of a sequence of videos where we found AVmale05b.

    These are the videos we had until now: ACP000fwfy
    ACP000fwh7
    ACP000fwh9
    ACP000fwhb
    ACP000fwhc
    ACP000fwax

    And the new sequence we have now, with the videos you posted, is ACP000fwa2
    ACP000fwa4
    ACP000fwa6
    ACP000fwft
    ACP000fwfw
    ACP000fwfy
    ACP000fwh7
    ACP000fwh9
    ACP000fwhb
    ACP000fwhc
    ACP000fwax
    ACP000fway
    ACP000fwaz
    ACP000fwb0
    ACP000fw9o
    ACP000fw9q
    ACP000fw9r
    ACP000fw9s

    Posted

  • PauDG by PauDG scientist, moderator

    Here that is generated with the videos tagged with "chimp".

    The great thing is that in that list the videos are sorted by time, so we can see the videos in order. Is very useful to see the whole video sequences.

    Posted

  • PauDG by PauDG scientist, moderator

    And, now that we are talking about AVmale05b..... what do you think about the match proposal between AVmale05 and AVmale05b?
    Here the link to that discussion ( https://talk.chimpandsee.org/#/boards/BCP000000s/discussions/DCP000187m)

    Thanks!

    Posted

  • puddock by puddock

    Thanks Paul - it's great to see the videos as a sequence. I'm not sure my identification skills are good enough yet but I'll have a look ...

    Posted

  • puddock by puddock

    After an initial look, I'm not convinced that they are the same (bearing in mind that I am very new to this!) I agree with luca-chimp that 05b looks sturdier and just plain bigger. Comparing them against the same tree it certainly looks as tho 05b is bigger. He looks greyer too, perhaps? I also wondered if I saw a difference in their noses - 05's nose in video Image ACP000fw6h looks a bit like a boxer's nose - squished. 05b's nose looks more regular... it isn't easy is it? 😃

    Posted

  • Boleyn by Boleyn moderator

    Let me throw in my 2 cents to this discussion: I think Paula is right and those two are the same chimp.

    Both have pretty dark hair. The difference comes from the different light situations. Once when the sun shines through also AVmale05 seems to have gray hair.
    All their traits are very similar: round head, no baldness, only kind of a middle-crest, narrow, bowed whitish brows, longish/round muzzle, high button nose with small nostrils. Paula pointed out the right ear which really does look the same with this uneven edge. The reason why AVmale05 looks smaller is because he's more leaning towards the tree than AVMale05b when sitting on the other side a bit in front of the tree closer to the camera which makes him look bigger. As @luca-chimp pointed out in the other discussion, they both use stones to crack the nuts. We know that they select their tool according to what's to crack so I think it's ok when they use different stones for cracking different nuts.

    Another argument though is a small bald spot on the right side of the lower belly. You can see it in both sequences which are some days apart according to the spreadsheet. So it can't be some debris. I'm sure with AVMale05 it's not his private parts because he practically lies on his left foot, the belly hanging a bit over the leg. The spot is best seen in ACP000fw6j.

    AVMale05

    enter image description here

    The spot in AVMale05b

    enter image description here

    Posted

  • luca-chimp by luca-chimp

    wow sherlock boleyn 😄 Im ever and ever impressed with your skill of detailed observation ... tomorrow I too will look after all the details you pointed out (to learn), but I think you are right ...

    Posted

  • Boleyn by Boleyn moderator

    hehe, thanks, @luca-chimp but compared to others here, escpecially our moderators or @Snorticus, I'm just a tiny Sherlock. I'm still learning every day too 😄

    Posted

  • Snorticus by Snorticus in response to Boleyn's comment.

    I think we all have our moments of insight, you guys, but thanks! 😉

    Posted

  • PauDG by PauDG scientist, moderator

    you all are amazing!!! great about the details you found Boleyn, this things help a lot!

    So, we have a match!? Who wants to choose a name?

    Posted

  • puddock by puddock

    I think I've got a lot to learn on the identification front!

    Posted

  • Boleyn by Boleyn moderator

    In the other thread about this chimp @luca-chimp already nick-named him Caruso. Why don't we just stick to that name? He's such a lovely singer and produces really nice food-grunts as @Snorticus already detected two months ago here.

    What do you all think?

    Posted

  • puddock by puddock in response to Boleyn's comment.

    Great idea!

    Posted

  • PauDG by PauDG scientist, moderator

    I like the idea! and the name 😉

    Caruso then. Thanks all!

    Posted

  • luca-chimp by luca-chimp

    Just saw, that Caruso is Caruso now 😄 Thanks @Boleyn! I didnt dare to suggest ... but really really love your choice to take the nick-name.

    Posted

  • PauDG by PauDG scientist, moderator

    😃

    Posted

  • Boleyn by Boleyn moderator

    You're very welcome @luca-chimp I loved the nickname from the beginning so this was an easy task 😄 😉

    Posted

  • Snorticus by Snorticus in response to Boleyn's comment.

    Good on you for going with luca-chimp's Caruso, Boleyn - so - appropriate for this talented fellow! 😃

    Posted

  • puddock by puddock

    @snorticus found this video - Image ACP000fwgc - wondered if it could be Caruso? He has the very familiar physical reaction to the pleasures of nut cracking ... 😃

    Posted

  • puddock by puddock

    Image ACP000fwge This video too... and Image ACP000fwga too ...oops - I think snorticus has already identified him in other parts of the sequence...

    Posted

  • PauDG by PauDG scientist, moderator

    but we didn't have the 2 first you have posted and you have identified Caruso too. You all are doing great!

    I am very happy with how Aged Violet is going 😄

    Posted

  • Boleyn by Boleyn moderator in response to puddock's comment.

    LOL @puddock - a seemingly very pleased Caruso indeed 😄

    Paula, I think the keyboard was playing tricks on your fingers. 😉

    Posted

  • PauDG by PauDG scientist, moderator

    ups!

    Posted

  • AnLand by AnLand moderator

    I still think that the male in ACP000eqtq and ACP000eqts is Caruso. Could we look into that again?

    enter image description here

    Posted

  • Boleyn by Boleyn moderator

    Oh I haven't seen those videos before!
    I fully support your proposal @AnLand. He's fluffy, massive, no obvious baldness on the forehead, the bent but narrow brows. Around second 6 we can shortly see the small notch in his lower right ear: That's our great singer!

    And while we are at it have a look at the guy following Filou in these videos: ACP000g5cx and ACP000g5cz This must be Caruso as well! Shots from second clip. I think it's one of the rare videos where both can be seen at once. Good for comparison!

    enter image description here

    enter image description here

    Posted

  • puddock by puddock

    I agree with @Anland - looks like Caruso to me too in both sets of videos - woo hoo 😃 Also, how lucky is that researcher!

    Posted

  • Boleyn by Boleyn moderator

    And I knew that YOU @puddock would be happy as well 😉

    Posted

  • puddock by puddock

    😃

    Posted

  • PauDG by PauDG scientist, moderator

    Am I the only one with problems to differentiate sometimes Caruso from Magnus?

    So everyone agrees that in ACP000eqtq and ACP000eqts is Caruso, right? and in ACP000g5cx / ACP000g5cz, does everyone also agree that is Caruso?

    Thanks

    Posted

  • Boleyn by Boleyn moderator

    Paula, one of the main differences I think is their baldness. Magnus has a wide baldness spreading almost over his entire forehead and he is very dark, almost black. Caruso has no really visible baldness and he is more fluffy and lighter in color.

    So yes, I'm still sure for both cases 😃

    Posted

  • AnLand by AnLand moderator

    I agree with the second sequence, suggested by @Boleyn, as well. Yes, they are not easy to distinguishable, but as @Boleyn said, Magnus is really very dark, while Caruso seems to have quite some gray hair on the back and looks always a bit more "shabby". The balding is difficult as you can see for Filou in that sequence (ACP000g5cx and ACP000g5cz) from the front view, there is only a little bit balding visible, but a quite bald forehead from the side view.

    On the other hand, when you are not sure that these are indeed two separate chimps, we should look into that with all known sequences. I am also not sure, what I am seeing here. It's more a feeling.

    Posted

  • PauDG by PauDG scientist, moderator

    ok! thanks all 😉

    Posted

  • PauDG by PauDG scientist, moderator

    What about this male, Caruso or Magnus?

    EDIT: I would now that he is Caruso. No baldness seen 😉

    ACP000fsgv

    one
    one

    Posted

  • PauDG by PauDG scientist, moderator

    And I think this is also Caruso.

    At the beginning I I doubted between Caruso and Magnus, but Caruso has a more grayish back, while Magnus is completely black.

    ACP000fifi Caruso??

    one

    Posted

  • PauDG by PauDG scientist, moderator

    And in the next video ACP000fijy , should be Magnus (EDIT: is Magnus)

    one

    Posted

  • PauDG by PauDG scientist, moderator

    Caruso?

    ACP000emi5

    one

    Posted

  • PauDG by PauDG scientist, moderator

    and this is also Caruso?

    ACP000emho

    one

    Posted

  • Boleyn by Boleyn moderator

    ACP000emi5 is Caruso, no doubt.

    As with ACP000emho I'm not sure. He looks more like Baron to me. I think the muzzle is too bright to be Caruso, I can see a clear shiny triangle bald spot, and I think there's also that ear fold on his left ear - the same as Baron has.

    Posted

  • AnLand by AnLand moderator

    I agree with @Boleyn. These are not both the same chimp and ACP000emho should be Baron (look at his left ear).

    Baron

    enter image description here

    ACP000emho

    enter image description here

    Posted

  • PauDG by PauDG scientist, moderator

    you are right! it is Baron 😉

    Thanks

    Posted

  • PauDG by PauDG scientist, moderator

    Now that we are talking about Caruso, in the the next videos we proposed matches with Caruso, but we never solved them.... what do you think?

    Thanks!

    ACP000ggj1
    ACP000ggj2
    ACP000fifi
    ACP000fifj
    ACP000fsgv

    Posted

  • Boleyn by Boleyn moderator

    ACP000ggj1 ACP000ggj2 agree, fluffy head when turning to Marlyn

    ACP000fifi ACP000fifj I already agreed in comments 😃

    ACP000fsgv it's always a bit hard to tell in b/w but I see no obvious baldness and the right ear seems to have a little notch = Caruso

    Posted

  • PauDG by PauDG scientist, moderator

    Thanks a lot Heidi, awesome!

    Posted

  • AnLand by AnLand moderator

    ACP000fwks / ACP000fwkt - this big male with a gray back should be Caruso. Ears are OK, so it's not Filou. Traits are consistent and I think the right ear looks very similar. I don't see Magnus here.

    Posted

  • PauDG by PauDG scientist, moderator

    I agree, this is Caruso

    Posted

  • AnLand by AnLand moderator

    The second male in ACP000g1b1 should be Caruso. Compare for instance ACP000fifi.

    Posted

  • Boleyn by Boleyn moderator in response to AnLand's comment.

    Yes, second is Caruso.

    I would like to add Baron as first chimp walking (compare first chimp in ACP000e5kr) and say Magnus is the fourth (after Jojo-Crann) compare video ACP000eaq0.

    Posted

  • AnLand by AnLand moderator

    So, Baron as a very long right testicle and Magnus in contrast has a left testicle that is slightly longer than his right one? This is a great observation! I did not see this before. So, I agree to the match proposals for ACP000g1b1.

    This obeservation should also help for other backview-only male assignments.

    For ACP000eaq0, please be aware that there is no juvenile in front of Magnus. It is also an adult male with full and dark testicles.

    Posted

  • Boleyn by Boleyn moderator in response to AnLand's comment.

    Ha, yes! and the right one of these full dark testies looks very long! Together with the size of this chimp (I think he's a little bit smaller than the other two) would tell it's Baron again!

    Posted

  • lauraklynn by lauraklynn moderator in response to Boleyn's comment.

    For ACP000g1b1 I agree with Caruso 2nd in line. I also agree with Magnus in 4th. Not sure about Baron.

    Posted

  • AnLand by AnLand moderator

    ACP000fs47 - as Filou with his blotched gray back is following later. The first male with the gray back must be Caruso. Nobody else has a gray back. Magnus, Caruso, and Baron are all black.

    The second one might be Magnus (even sized testicles), but it is hard to see.

    Posted

  • Boleyn by Boleyn moderator

    First one ought to be Caruso for the grey back. The second I think is Baron: He's a bit smaller and has this nondescript butt. With Magnus we should see the bright callousy cushions. I think the testies actually might be uneven.

    enter image description here

    Baron:

    enter image description here

    Posted

  • PauDG by PauDG scientist, moderator

    same thing, we need a picture of all the males back to be able to match them based on it, Thanks

    Posted