Chimp & See Talk

Etta & inf -- Match to AVfem04b and AVinf04b?

  • lauraklynn by lauraklynn moderator

    So I can't point out any definitive scars or markings to say that this is the same pair, but they look very similar to me. The infant has the same brow line, nose and facial features. The female has the same posture and similar hair coverage.

    Sequence: ACP00041h, ACP000e41j, ACP000e41l

    The adult has a slight nick in her right ear and 2 marks on her right brow. It's hard to tell, but I think she may have a cut in her left ear as well (If so, this makes the match a little less likely, but it's hard to see details of the adult in the _04b videos). She also has a small patch of missing hair on the back of her neck:

    Front shot of infant as well as a look at the adult standing up:

    And here is one of AVjuv04b (from ACP000fck2):

    Posted

  • Boleyn by Boleyn moderator

    Mainly based on the juvenile I would support this match. This little one has some distinctive traits like the dark region under the nose and the almost triangular looking brows. Such a cutie 😃

    Can we say the infant is a girl based on video ACP000fck4 ?

    enter image description here

    Posted

  • lauraklynn by lauraklynn moderator

    From that video, I would say the infant is a female, yes.

    Posted

  • AnLand by AnLand moderator

    I think, we also should discuss AVFem07 & AVInf07 ( ACP000eml7 / ACP000eml9 ) here as well. The similarities are very close and her infant is a girl, too. Unfortunately, her right ear, the possibly slightly damaged one, is not seen. This match to AVFem04 was suggested before.

    Posted

  • PauDG by PauDG scientist, moderator

    I agree with your proposal @lauraklynn, it is the same infant (female).

    What about AVfem04? do you think we can do the match also with her? the notch in the right ear is not visible, at least i don't see it, but could be because she is far and the b/w video, but the round (or even flat) face with big ears are very similar

    Posted

  • PauDG by PauDG scientist, moderator in response to AnLand's comment.

    I am not sure about AVFem07, i find her face longer. Don't you think?

    Posted

  • AnLand by AnLand moderator in response to PauDG's comment.

    Hm, longer? If anything, I would say less broad. What irritates me most are the very, very prominent nipples, that I cannot see in the other. The perspective is different, but I would expect to see them. I will look later again. Also in AVFem04 and 04b. Need to go now.

    Posted

  • PauDG by PauDG scientist, moderator

    I meant that AVfem04 and AVfem04b have a rounder face/head than AVFem07. And also the nipples... 😕

    Posted

  • Boleyn by Boleyn moderator

    It's not only head and nipples, the infant of AVFem07 is considerably smaller than the one discussed here.

    Posted

  • lauraklynn by lauraklynn moderator in response to PauDG's comment.

    I'm not sure about AVfem04 or her infant. The lighting is so different and I'm not seeing enough identifying marks. In https://talk.chimpandsee.org/#/boards/BCP000000s/discussions/DCP0001988 I said I thought she might be a match to AVfem05, but I think I was mixing up who was who in the videos.

    Posted

  • lauraklynn by lauraklynn moderator

    Not that I want to complicate things further, but I just stumbled on this video and this one with a similar looking infant and possibly the same adult female, but she appears to have a snare on her foot:

    I don't see any indications of a snare in the other videos being discussed, but the adult doesn't move around a whole lot in them, and we don't get a good look at the foot.

    Posted

  • AnLand by AnLand moderator in response to lauraklynn's comment.

    I do not really have time this morning, but concerning your last videos ( ACP000emi7 etc.) I think that this female has a much narrower face (or longer as @PauDG would say 😉 ). She has very visible nipples, so we might look into AVFem07. But she does not have a snared foot and also not a beard.

    I looked briefly in the longer scene of AVFem07. Her right ear seems to be fine. I cannot see any damage.

    Posted

  • PauDG by PauDG scientist, moderator

    I think this female ( ACP000emi7) has even a more elongated face than Fem07 😕

    Posted

  • Boleyn by Boleyn moderator

    The infants have a lot in common. However I think they are not the same. The nose of AVInf04 is quite bright and smaller while this one's here is broad and dark. Also the brows are not as regular as Inf04's brows.

    Posted

  • PauDG by PauDG scientist, moderator

    So, we do the match between ACP000e41j / AVfem04b and AVfem04 for now?

    Posted

  • PauDG by PauDG scientist, moderator

    @lauraklynn , would you like to select a name to the female? (we leave the infants to the end of the site)

    Thanks a lot!

    Posted

  • lauraklynn by lauraklynn moderator in response to AnLand's comment.

    I agree the adult doesn't look the same. That infant had me fooled though.

    Posted

  • lauraklynn by lauraklynn moderator in response to PauDG's comment.

    Let's call her Etta. 😃

    Posted

  • Boleyn by Boleyn moderator

    Very nice! It made me immediately think of Etta James the great blues singer 😃

    Posted

  • puddock by puddock

    Etta - nice!

    Posted

  • PauDG by PauDG scientist, moderator

    Great! thanks a lot 😉

    Posted

  • Snorticus by Snorticus in response to lauraklynn's comment.

    Etta, great name! (and also agree that Etta James is a fine singer, #Boleyn 😃 ) This looks like more of Etta and her infant on 12-26-2014 at 10:23.
    ACP000e41f is the same day at 10:17

    ACP000e3y5 ACP000e3y7 ACP000e3y9 ACP000e3ya

    ACP000e3y9 Compare the notched right ears.

    enter image description here

    ACP000e41h Etta's notched right ear.

    enter image description here

    Posted

  • Snorticus by Snorticus

    No date on this set but looks to me like more of Etta with her cut right ear and her extremely cute little girl:

    ACP000e43a ACP000e43c ACP000e43e ACP000e43g

    ACP000e43c

    enter image description here

    ACP000e43g

    enter image description here

    ACP000e43g

    enter image description here

    Posted

  • Snorticus by Snorticus

    More of this series of Etta & infant from 12-26-2014.

    ACP000e3wn - time 10:19

    enter image description here

    enter image description here

    Posted

  • puddock by puddock in response to Snorticus's comment.

    I've just come across these videos myself and I thought exactly the same - it was the bare patch on the back of the neck that made me wonder if this was Etta. The juvenile is adorable!

    Posted

  • lauraklynn by lauraklynn moderator in response to Snorticus's comment.

    I agree. Etta and her infant 😃

    Posted

  • PauDG by PauDG scientist, moderator

    Hi all!
    I agree, she is Etta, with the notch in the middle part of the right ear.

    And the first female of ACP000e41f? She seems to have also a cut/notch in the right ear, but in the upper part

    Posted

  • Snorticus by Snorticus

    Dated 12-26-2014 time 10:21 more of this sequence of Etta & her girl.

    ACP000e3uv ACP000e3uw ACP000e3ux ACP000e3uy

    ACP000e3ux Ear notch mostly hidden here but a nice additional angle of view of her face.

    enter image description here

    Posted

  • PauDG by PauDG scientist, moderator

    great, thank you very much 😉

    Posted

  • AnLand by AnLand moderator

    I suggest that in ACP000edvs and ACP000edvt we see Etta and her infant close to the camera. Etta based on the small nick in her righr ear, the baldness, uneven brows, and protruded swelling. The infant is following her and looks like her infant. Sorry, pictures aren't great.

    enter image description here

    enter image description here

    enter image description here

    Posted

  • PauDG by PauDG scientist, moderator

    I agree, that is Etta's ear 😉

    Posted

  • Boleyn by Boleyn moderator

    Yes I think it's Etta too. If it was Fianna the right ear would show a bigger cut.

    Posted

  • PauDG by PauDG scientist, moderator

    great! thanks 😉

    Posted

  • PauDG by PauDG scientist, moderator

    Could be Etta, right? has a notch in the right ear

    ACP000fbqo

    one
    one

    Etta ( ACP000e41l)

    one
    one

    Posted

  • Boleyn by Boleyn moderator

    Looks like Etta, yes! also the triangular bald spot and I think the scars in her right brow can be seen. 😃

    Posted

  • PauDG by PauDG scientist, moderator

    Thanks Heidi!

    Posted

  • AnLand by AnLand moderator

    I kind of already agreed in the video comment, I guess. 😉

    Posted

  • PauDG by PauDG scientist, moderator

    Thanks Anja!

    Posted

  • AnLand by AnLand moderator

    ACP000fue3 - the first female with the dorsal infant seems to be Etta. Wide face, bold brows, protruded swelling, quite big infant. No idea about the following female (she has a swelling, I'd say, so should be female, too).

    Posted

  • PauDG by PauDG scientist, moderator

    ufff, this is getting complicated!

    I don't know. I can not see well the ears, I don not find anything special that allows me to take out the rest of the females... I am not sure 😕

    Posted

  • Boleyn by Boleyn moderator

    It's a tough one, let's see if we can exclude some females/infants here:

    Makena? no, this one is too dark and not as slim/grey, Makena's typical traits are missing

    Ray? no, no grey legs, head/face not as bright as Ray, the heaby arms are missing and she's generally less massive built

    Desta? no, this one here seems less big and slimmer, other than that, it can't be Azize following her, he's bigger/heavier

    Fianna? no, Fianna definitely is more massive and bigger

    Taiga? probably not, because her infant is still quite small in January. I can't remember seeing it walking alone? And there's no juvenile around

    Sekai: would be my guess, she's about the same size as Etta, her face is a little darker in b/w videos (ACP000fxpn) and we have seen that her infant is running after her in ACP000fxpo

    Posted

  • JoanaPereira by JoanaPereira

    Just from that video, can´t really tell if she´s Sekai or Etta or even any other female 😕

    Posted

  • PauDG by PauDG scientist, moderator

    Thanks

    Posted